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London Elections 2008


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#31 Muzza

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Posted 23 March 2008 - 01:45 PM

Basically Ken has failed miserably on transport... given school Kids free transport & driven a lot of londoners to their car where they are charged thru the roof as they like to travel in comfort.

I don't understand why you think this is a bad thing...

... & driven a lot of londoners to their car where they are charged thru the roof as they like to travel in comfort.

The statistics suggest the very opposite, in fact - the number of passengers on buses and trains is at an all-time high, and there are fewer cars on the road than there were before the introduction of the congestion charge.

#32 Ziwa

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Posted 23 March 2008 - 02:41 PM

Ken is really annoying as a personality, but he is looked at from the outside world as someone who looks for innovative solutions to tough problems. When I travel and talk to people interested in urban planning or green issues, they often ask me about Ken's impact in London - many of his initiatives are seen as groundbreaking. He's a maverick - got way too big an ego, probably has been in power too long, has done a couple of horrendous things, but more positive things. He's a darn sight better than the competition if you ask me.

#33 Muzza

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Posted 29 March 2008 - 09:41 PM

Interesting piece about the mayoral candidates in The Independent today:

http://www.independe...ote-802355.html

The point about X Factor is bang on, unfortunately...

Edited by Muzza, 29 March 2008 - 09:42 PM.


#34 Dazza

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Posted 29 March 2008 - 11:49 PM

Drug deales, murderers, gang members masquerading as kids & we pay for it thats why I think free travel for kids is a bad thing !

Very few people can afford to travel by car into london anymore ! The few who can are then charged thru the nose! It is just a money making exercise & does not deter the filthy rich from driving big cars.

Do you really think people enjoy travelling on london transport ? I'm bet the independant didnt highlight the increase of crime on london transport in this rather interesting piece.

I will eat my jockey shorts if Ken manages another term !

Dazza

Edited by Dazza, 29 March 2008 - 11:50 PM.

Your obviously mistaken me with someone who gives a fig

#35 Zirconium

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 03:16 PM

Quote "I will eat my jockey shorts if Ken manages another term ! "

With or without HP sauce?

#36 Dazza

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 04:58 PM

HP of course !

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#37 Muzza

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Posted 01 April 2008 - 11:53 PM

Very few people can afford to travel by car into london anymore ! The few who can are then charged thru the nose! It is just a money making exercise & does not deter the filthy rich from driving big cars.

Then I'm sure you'll welcome the change in the Congestion Charge coming in October (I think), whereby small, cheap cars won't have to pay anything at all, while big, expensive gas guzzlers have to pay more... ;) (If the current mayor is still in place, that is.)

The C Charge is far from perfect and Livingstone admitted as much when it was introduced (I think he said something along the lines of if anyone could think of a better way of reducing congestion he'd use it). But despite its initial controversy it's been successful enough for other cities to start copying the scheme. And, most telling of all, if Boris gets in he won't scrap it. Getting rid of Ken won't get rid of the C Charge - it's here to stay because it works.

Do you really think people enjoy travelling on london transport?

Well obviously I'd much rather swan around London in some posh chauffeur-driven car, but that's never gonna happen... :D In my experience transport in London is fine - the new trains and buses actually pretty clean and comfortable. I certainly think it's less stressful than a daily drive into and out of the centre would be. Maybe I'm just lucky, but the worst thing I've had to deal with is the occasional late running of the train to Victoria.

#38 Dazza

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 10:18 AM

I work in London & see absolutely no difference in traffic since the start of the C charge the average speed in the city is still about 4 mph. Clean comfortable trains/busses dont make me laugh !!!!!!! There are several places in world call Victoria are you still talking about the one in London ?

C charge will stay perhaps but Ken another term I hope not .

Dazza
Your obviously mistaken me with someone who gives a fig

#39 gekko

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 11:28 AM

The new Southern trains are actually pretty pleasant. It's the overcrowding that is the problem. They are mostly filled to capacity and with more people using them each year, I do wonder what the future holds. The time-keeping doesn't seem too bad for my usual journey at the moment but at times it's hell and because I have connections it can seriously bugger things up for me when there are delays.

I did drive to work (CP to White City) for about 18 months but to be honest it took the same length of time and there were frequent problems on the roads due to roadworks, accidents and events. Also, it was mega-stressful as you are crawling along a lot of the time, getting carved up and dealing with aggressive drivers. I found myself frazzled by the time I reached work so I gave it up and started getting the train again. At least I can get a seat at CP and at Victoria and I can read my book for relaxation. It's not ideal as my journey involves 2 trains and a bus or a train and 2 tubes but I've tried to work my journey around trains that are fairly reliable to minimise stress. I've also negotiated working from home one day a week, which is helping a lot.

Overall though, London transport is less than ideal, whichever way you look at it. It's too expensive, overcrowded, unreliable and often doesn't take you where you want to go directly. In terms of the elections, I'll be looking for the candidate who I believe has the gumption to really turn things around, if indeed there is one. The trouble with Ken's proposals is that they all focused too heavily on raising revenue from an unpopular congestion charge. You can't seriously change things unless you get the buy-in from the general public. Unfortunately, his congestion charge policy is based on the fact that we'll be convinced of the method when we see the amazing results. Unfortunately, the results haven't been forthcoming so we are unconvinced. Also, the answers cannot be found in just one place. There are too many people working in too small a place and we need to start thinking more holistically about how to manage that. I think ultimately some of the answers lie in companies relocating and more people working remotely. This can be unpopular with company managers but when they start to seriously lose profits due to people being two hours late for work, they'll soon change their minds.

Edited by gekko, 02 April 2008 - 11:33 AM.

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#40 Elmo

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 02:26 PM

I work in London & see absolutely no difference in traffic since the start of the C charge the average speed in the city is still about 4 mph.


The point seems to be that the C Charge stabilised traffic levels. Imagine how bad things would be without it... plus there's extra cash for more and cheaper public transport. Seems like a good deal to me.
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#41 Come on you Irons

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 02:56 PM

where is your evidence for cheaper and more transport? Fares have gone up way over the rate of inflation ever since the CC came in, or are we just subsidising the free travel for under 15's? Brilliant. Well done Ken.

Not having a go Elmo by the way, i just think pricing and standard of transport has dived since he became Mayor. Where exactly is the revenue going? Because it certainly isnt on the promised transport improvements.

#42 Dazza

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 03:05 PM

No good going to work in a rolls royce if you sharing it with 50 other people ! I wonder how many people think that their season ticket is good value for money ?

London has one of the most fare expensive rail systems in europe with one of the worst performance records in europe.

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#43 gekko

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 03:15 PM

I'm afraid I'm also not convinced that the money from the CC is going into better transport. Certainly, my experience of travelling in London hasn't improved since the introduction of the system. Instead transport is more crowded and more expensive to use. I'm sure a lot of the revenue is spent on cameras and administration.

With regard to the level of traffic, I think it's self-regulating anyway. I do wonder if the fact that the level of traffic has stabalised has more to do with the fact that it's at capacity anyway.
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#44 nickyb-inthecp

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 04:16 PM

I think you may to turn to the small print on this issue...

Yes, Ken promised to use the CC cash to improve public transport, however he was only able to deploy this cash to the elements of the transport system that he directly owned. Therefore the buses got the cash, and so did the London 'overground network'. Not the "train-system-formally-known-as-british-rail" which we endure in SE19/20 etc.

Also, with regard to the fare increases, i totally agree - but this has more to do with the shift in central government policy than Ken's whims. Sadly our esteemed government decided in 1997 that a greater burden for public services should be met by those using them rather than them being subsidised by car driving income tax payers.

Check it here: http://news.bbc.co.u.../uk/7166663.stm

So.... i think Ken isn't as far to blame as many think.

#45 Come on you Irons

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Posted 02 April 2008 - 06:34 PM

Ok Nicky, I see your point. But surely at least part of the underground was under his jurisdiction! Remember Bob Kiley ? The yank he brought in? What was his remit?. Where has the CC money really gone? A few bendy buses, and an east london line extension that is a relatively cheap excercise given that most of the line has already been built.....CP to Whitechapel, and even the track bedding was there for the shoreditch to dalston bit, as it used to be the Broad St to Watford line. (spotter alert!)

So many questions, so little time!......perhaps i really should get out more, or maybe its my unfaltering hatred of our mayor