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is there more to life than this?


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#16 RetiredMember2

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 11:30 AM

You are spot on with the source of his angst being Dawkins. Middle class dinner party atheism MCDPA, am liking it. As a phrase not a pastime that is...

#17 RachelF

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 11:39 AM

I would have thought fundamental apathy was the more apposite term.

Dawkins is an evangelical atheist isn't he?!

His opinons are probably themselves memes.

Sorry he annoys me. Nothing against atheism or agnosticism in principal. Evangelism is alright I suppose as long as it's not knocking on your door at 10am on a Sunday morning, (shouldn't they be in church at 9am on a Sundy anyway?!)or stopping you on the way to the last through train home in the evening i.e as long as it's not thrust upon you.
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#18 Dazza

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 11:43 AM

My Cathedral is the Palace Spice & my pint is never empty but always full with plenty in reserve.

I also visit my place of worship very regular ! My parish also includes Wilf / SL / SLR / Ziwa to name a few

Hail to the Ale !

Dazza

PS No organ though !

Edited by Dazza, 10 September 2010 - 11:48 AM.

Your obviously mistaken me with someone who gives a fig

#19 RetiredMember2

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 12:08 PM

I like the sound of your Cathedral Dazza just a shame it doesn't have an organ.

#20 misspoddy

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 12:47 PM

One of the things the Bishop spoke about was how he sees "fundamental atheism" as the biggest threat to religion today. First time I've heard that phrase but I would have thought fundamentalism full stop is the biggest threat. I have not heard of any atheists suicide attacks on churches but maybe that's because the religous fundamentalists (think the clue's in the last part of the word) have that corner of the market well and truly covered.It's a mad mad world :unsure:


My grand mother at the tender age of 95 was still fantasizing about making her last action in life killing the pope... Kinda understand what she meant, but I guess I'm more of a MCDPA than a FA.... :rolleyes:

#21 JamesS

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Posted 11 September 2010 - 06:14 PM

I would encourage people to be careful with these courses. They are ultimately are set up to encourage people to join.

And if anyone's talking about a "threat" it's because more and more people are thinking more about the world, the universe and everything, rather than blindly accepting something which in my view makes no sense.

Rant over!
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#22 davidpuppet

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Posted 12 September 2010 - 03:17 PM

but surely if more and more people are thinking about these things, they wouldn't blindly accept something, would they? that earlier quote re 'opium'. where does it come from? reminds me of something russell brand said about heroin in his booky. that heroin takes you out of reality, and that some say it's a substitute for the longing we are supposed to feel for God. something like that anyway, although put rather more eloquently.

#23 RetiredMember2

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Posted 12 September 2010 - 08:03 PM

The post about opium is one of the most commonly quoted statements of Karl Marx. When he wrote that "religion is the opitiate of the masses" he was making the comparrison that an opiate drug relieves pain and suffering but fails to fix a physical injury. Similarly, religion does not fix the underlying causes of people’s pain and suffering but helps them forget why they are suffering by getting them to focus on an imaginary future when the pain will cease.

I suppose what he is saying is that religion creates illusory fantasies for the poor, sick and old because it tells them they will find true happiness in the next life. I think he has a point! There's one school of religious thought that says the more you suffer/sacrifice in this life the greater your heavenly rewards will be this is in stark contrast to the Prosperity Gospel ideology that the wealthier/healthier you are in this life the closer you are to God.

#24 Dazza

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Posted 13 September 2010 - 09:36 AM

Far too many religious threads creeping on this forum lately for my liking.

I have enough crackpots & weirdos knocking on my door trying to convert me & its only a matter of time when religion is going to be sold in supermarkets.

I am happy enough with my lot without the need to prey to an imaginairy force, contentment & happiness for me is when my shares go up in price !

A true athiest & capitalist me !

Dazza

PS If there was a devil i think the Pope would be an ideal candidate though!
Your obviously mistaken me with someone who gives a fig

#25 RetiredMember2

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Posted 13 September 2010 - 11:13 AM

Speak of the devil ....... the Pope's visit is estimated to cost us £20M :ph34r: http://www.guardian....-british-visits

#26 RachelF

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 11:09 AM

I feel a little uncomfortable about this thread too, Dazza, but I don't think it's contravening any VN rules (although your comment about the Pope might be!)
Still it (the thread) seems to have evolved into an intellectual discussion, which in my mind isn't bad. As long as we avoid invective!
citizenm I very much respect your views, but there is more to religion than promise of the afterlife. As I said I am not a church goer any more but it's not all about heaven and hell in my opinon. There is such a thing as spirituality, I think (not to be confused with spiritualism!)
Dazza, do you think they might do religious BOGOF in the supermarkets?!
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#27 RetiredMember2

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 03:53 PM

citizenm I very much respect your views, but there is more to religion than promise of the afterlife. As I said I am not a church goer any more but it's not all about heaven and hell in my opinon. There is such a thing as spirituality, I think (not to be confused with spiritualism!)


Hi Rachel those were not my views but my (poor) attempt at a brief interpretation of the quote from revolutionary, philosopher extrodinaire, Karl Marx. They were made in response to davidpuppet's question, " that earlier quote re 'opium'. where does it come from?"

I do agree there's a lot more to religion than the after life, although I am a big believer in eternal rest as opposed to raising hell these days :rolleyes:

#28 davidpuppet

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 04:05 PM

maybe it's because people feel empty spiritually that they turn to alcohol,drugs,etc?

#29 Uncle Wilf

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:14 AM

maybe it's because people feel empty spiritually that they turn to alcohol,drugs,etc?


Everyone's searching for something and everyone's got to serve somebody. Any which way... even the middle class dinner party atheists (who by the way sometimes find themselves pitching up in church just to get their kid into a decent school) are in pursuit of something.

The challenge to atheism is the same to religion or spirituality: does it cut it, and what's the state of your life like? Straightforward really. Anyone can spout any kind of belief because words are cheap normally, but what's the fruit.

Anyway that's what I reckon. I'll go back to my Palace Spice thread now.
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#30 Dazza

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:39 AM

Welcome back to my Flock Wilf !
Your obviously mistaken me with someone who gives a fig